Phaedrus — Part 1

0:1414 secondsphaedra is my friend where have you been and where are you going i was with lysius son of kaepelus socrates and
0:2222 secondsi'm going for a walk outside the city walls because i was with him for a long time sitting
0:2929 secondsyou see i'm keeping i'm keeping in mind the advice of our mutual friend at cuminas who says that it's it's more
0:3636 secondsrefreshing to walk along the country roads than the city streets he's quite right too my friend
0:4444 secondsso lazy as i take it is in the city yes yes at the house of epicritus which used to belong to maurice near the
0:5353 secondstemple of the olympian zeus and what were you doing there oh i know lyceus must have been
1:001 minuteentertaining you with a feast of eloquence you'll hear all about it if you're free to come along and listen
1:081 minute, 8 secondswhat don't you think i would consider it the most important and most pressing engagement as pandar says
1:161 minute, 16 secondsto hear how you and lysius spent your time lead the way then if only you will tell me
1:241 minute, 24 secondsin fact socrates you were just the right person to hear the speech that occupied us since in a roundabout way it was about
1:331 minute, 33 secondslove it's aimed at seducing a beautiful boy but the speaker is not in love with him
1:411 minute, 41 secondsthis is actually what is so clever and elegant about it lysius argues that it's better to give your favors to someone
1:481 minute, 48 secondswho does not love you than to someone who does what a wonderful man i wish he would write that you should give your favors
1:571 minute, 57 secondsto a poor man rather than to a rich man into an older rather than a younger one
2:032 minutes, 3 secondsthat is someone like me and most other people then his speeches would be really sophisticated and they'd contribute to
2:112 minutes, 11 secondsthe common good besides in any case i am so eager to hear that i would follow you even if you are walking all the way
2:192 minutes, 19 secondsto megura as herodocus recommends to touch the wall and come back again what on earth do you mean socrates
2:272 minutes, 27 secondsdo you think that a mere dilettante like me could recite from memory a speech that took lysius
2:342 minutes, 34 secondsthe best of our writers took such time and trouble to compose far from it though actually i would be rather able to do that
2:432 minutes, 43 secondsmore than come into a large fortune oh phaedras if i don't know my features i must be forgetting who i myself
2:512 minutes, 51 secondsam and neither is the case i know very well that he did not hear lyceus speech only once he asked him
2:582 minutes, 58 secondsto repeat it over and over again and lysius was eager to oblige but not even that was enough for him no in
3:053 minutes, 5 secondsthe end he took the book himself and poured over the parts of it that he liked best he sat reading all morning long and when he got tired
3:133 minutes, 13 secondshe went for a walk having learned i'm quite sure the whole speech by heart unless it was extraordinarily long
3:233 minutes, 23 secondsso he started out for the country where he could practice reciting it and running into a man who is sick with passion
3:313 minutes, 31 secondsfor hearing speeches seeing him just seeing him he was filled with the light he had found his partner
3:383 minutes, 38 secondsfor his frenzy dance and urged him to lead the way but when that lover of speeches asked him to recite it
3:453 minutes, 45 secondshe played coy and pretended that he did not want to in the end of course he was going to recite it even if he had to force
3:523 minutes, 52 secondsan unwilling audience to listen so please phaedras beg him to do it right now he'll do it soon enough anyway
4:004 minuteswell i'd better try to recite it as best as i can you'll obviously not leave me in peace until i do so
4:084 minutes, 8 secondsone way or the other you are absolutely right that's what i'll do then but socrates it really is true that i did not memorize
4:154 minutes, 15 secondsthe speech word for word instead i'll give you a careful summary of its general sense listing all the ways he
4:234 minutes, 23 secondssays that a non-lover differs from the lover in the proper order only if you will first show me
4:314 minutes, 31 secondswhat you're holding in your left hand under your cloak my friend i strongly suspect that
4:394 minutes, 39 secondsyou have the speech itself and if i'm right you can be sure even though i love you dearly
4:464 minutes, 46 secondsi'll never as long as lysius himself is present allow you to practice your speech making on me
4:534 minutes, 53 secondscome on then show me off enough you've dashed my hopes of using you as my training partner socrates
5:025 minutes, 2 secondsall right where do you want to sit while we read uh let's leave the path here and just walk around along the elissus then we
5:125 minutes, 12 secondscan sit quietly wherever we find the right spot how lucky then that i am barefoot you are
5:195 minutes, 19 secondsalways barefoot the easiest thing to do is to just walk right in the stream this way we'll also get our feet wet
5:275 minutes, 27 secondswhich is very pleasant especially at this hour in season lead the way then and find us a place to sit do you see that very tall plane truck of
5:365 minutes, 36 secondscourse it's shady with a light breeze we can sit or if you prefer lie down on the grass there lead on then
5:465 minutes, 46 secondstell me socrates isn't it from somewhere near this place that this near this stretch of the alias that
5:535 minutes, 53 secondspeople say boris carried orthuio away will they say couldn't this be the very spot
6:006 minutesthe stream is lovely pure and clear just right for girls to be playing nearby no it's two or three hundred yards
6:096 minutes, 9 secondsfarther downstream where one crosses to get to the district of agra i think there's even an altar to bore us there i hadn't noticed it but tell me socrates
6:186 minutes, 18 secondsin the name of zeus do you really believe that legend is true actually it wouldn't be out of place for me to reject it as our intellectuals do
6:266 minutes, 26 secondsi could then tell a clever story i could claim that a gust of the north wind blew her over the rocks where she was playing with
6:346 minutes, 34 secondspharmacia and when she was killed that way people said she'd been carried off by boris or was it perhaps
6:416 minutes, 41 secondsfrom the areopagus the story is also told that she was carried away from there instead now phaedra's
6:486 minutes, 48 secondssuch explanations are amusing enough but they're a job for a man i cannot envy at all he'd have to be far too
6:556 minutes, 55 secondsingenious and work too hard mainly because after that he will have to go on to give a rational account
7:037 minutes, 3 secondsof the form of the hippocentars and then of the chimera and a whole flood of gorgons and pegasus and other monsters in large numbers and
7:117 minutes, 11 secondsabsurd forms will overwhelm him anyone who does not believe in them who wants to explain them away and
7:187 minutes, 18 secondsmake them plausible by means of some sort of rough ingenuity will need a great deal of time but i have no time for such things
7:257 minutes, 25 secondsand the reason my friend is this i am still unable as the delphic inscription orders to
7:337 minutes, 33 secondsknow myself and it really seems ridiculous to look into other things before i have understood
7:417 minutes, 41 secondsthat this is why i don't concern myself with them i accept what is generally believed and
7:497 minutes, 49 secondsas i was just saying i won't look into them but into myself am i a beast
7:577 minutes, 57 secondsmore complicated and savage than typhon or am i a teamer simpler animal with a share
8:048 minutes, 4 secondsin a divine and gentle nature look my friend while we were talking haven't we reached the tree that you were taking us to
8:138 minutes, 13 secondsthat's the one by hera it really is a beautiful resting place the plane tree is tall and very broad
8:228 minutes, 22 secondsthe chaste tree high as it is is wonderfully shady and since it is in full bloom the whole place is
8:318 minutes, 31 secondsfilled with its fragrance from under the plain tree the loveliest spring runs
8:388 minutes, 38 secondswith very cool water our feet can testify to that the place appears to be dedicated to
8:468 minutes, 46 secondsoculus or and some of the nips if we can judge from the statues and the votive offerings
8:548 minutes, 54 secondsfeel the freshness of the air how pretty and pleasant it is how it echoes with the summery sweet
9:029 minutes, 2 secondssong of the cicadas's chorus the most exquisite thing of all of course is this grassy slope it rises
9:119 minutes, 11 secondsso gently you can rest your head on it perfectly when you lie down on it you've really
9:199 minutes, 19 secondsbeen the most marvelous guide my dear phaedras and you my remarkable friend appear to be totally
9:269 minutes, 26 secondsout of place really just as you say you seem to need a guide not to be one of the locals
9:349 minutes, 34 secondsnot only do you never travel abroad as far as i can tell you've never even set foot beyond the city walls forgive me my friend
9:429 minutes, 42 secondsi'm devoted to learning landscapes and trees they have nothing to teach me
9:509 minutes, 50 secondsonly the people in the city can do that but you i think have found a potion to charm me into leaving
9:579 minutes, 57 secondsfor just as people lead hungry animals away by shaking branches of fruit before them you can lead me
10:0410 minutes, 4 secondsall over attica or anywhere else you like simply by waving in front of me the leaves of a book
10:1110 minutes, 11 secondscontaining a speech but now having gotten as far as this place and this time around
10:1910 minutes, 19 secondsi intend to lie down so choose whatever position you think will be most comfortable for you and read on
10:2710 minutes, 27 secondslisten though you understand my situation i've told
10:3410 minutes, 34 secondsyou how good it would be for us in my opinion if this worked out in any case i don't think i should lose the
10:4210 minutes, 42 secondschance to get what i am asking for merely because i don't happen to be in love with you a man in love will wish he had done you no favors at all once his
10:5010 minutes, 50 secondsdesire dies down but the time will never come for a man who's not in love to change his mind that is because the favors he does for
10:5810 minutes, 58 secondsyou are not forced but voluntary and he does the best that he possibly can for you just as he would
11:0511 minutes, 5 secondsfor his own business besides a lover keeps his eye on the balance sheet where his interests have suffered from love
11:1311 minutes, 13 secondsand where he's done well and when he adds up all the trouble he has taken he thinks he's long since given the boy he loved
11:2011 minutes, 20 secondshis fair return a non-lover on the other hand can't complain about loves making him neglect his own business and can't keep a tab on the trouble he's
11:2811 minutes, 28 secondsbeen through or blame you for the trouble for the quarrels he's had with his relatives take away all those headaches and
11:3611 minutes, 36 secondsthere's nothing left for him to do but just put his heart into whatever he thinks will give pleasure besides suppose a lover does deserve to
11:4511 minutes, 45 secondsbe honored because as they say he is the best friend his loved one will ever have and he stands ready to please the boy
11:5311 minutes, 53 secondswith all those words and deeds that are so annoying to everyone else it's easy to see if he's telling the truth that the time
12:0112 minutes, 1 secondthe next time he falls in love he will care more for his new love than for the old one it's clear he'll treat this old one shabbily
12:0912 minutes, 9 secondswhenever it will please the new one and anyway what sense does it make to throw away something like that on a
12:1612 minutes, 16 secondsperson who has fallen and led to such a miserable condition that those who have suffered it don't even try to defend themselves against it
12:2512 minutes, 25 secondsa lover will admit that he's more sick than sound in the head he's well aware that he's not thinking straight
12:3312 minutes, 33 secondsbut he'll say he can't get himself under control so when does he start thinking straight
12:4112 minutes, 41 secondswhy why would he stand beside decisions that he made when he was sick another point if you were to choose the
12:5012 minutes, 50 secondsbest of the from the best of those who are in love with you you'd have a pretty small group to pick from
12:5712 minutes, 57 secondsbut you'll have a large group if you don't care whether he loves you or not and just pick the one who suits you best and in that larger pool
13:0613 minutes, 6 secondsyou'll have a much better hope of finding someone who deserves your friendship now suppose you're afraid of
13:1313 minutes, 13 secondsconventional standards and the stigma that will come from you come to you if people find out about this
13:2113 minutes, 21 secondswell it stands to reason that a lover thinking that everyone will admire him for his success as much as he admires
13:2813 minutes, 28 secondshimself will fly into words and proudly declare to all and sundry that his labors were not in vain someone
13:3713 minutes, 37 secondswho does not love you on the other hand can control himself and will choose to do what is best
13:4413 minutes, 44 secondsrather than seek the glory that comes from popular reputation besides it is inevitable that a lover will be
13:5313 minutes, 53 secondsfound out many people will see that when that he devotes his life to following the young boy as he loves the
14:0214 minutes, 2 secondsresult is that whenever people see you talking with him they'll think that you are spending time together just before or just
14:0914 minutes, 9 secondsafter giving way to desire but they won't even begin to find fault with people for spending time together if they are
14:1714 minutes, 17 secondsnot lovers they know one has to talk to someone either out of friendship or to
14:2314 minutes, 23 secondsobtain some pleasure all right another point have you been alarmed by the thought
14:3014 minutes, 30 secondsthat it is hard for friendships to last or that when people break up it's ordinarily just as awful for the one side as it is for the
14:3914 minutes, 39 secondsother but when you've given up what is most important to you already then your loss is greater than his if so
14:4814 minutes, 48 secondsit wouldn't make more it would make more sense for you to be afraid of lovers
14:5514 minutes, 55 secondsfor a lover is easily annoyed and whatever happens he'll think it was designed to hurt him that is why a lover
15:0315 minutes, 3 secondsprevents the boy that he loves for spending time with other people he's afraid that wealthy men will outshine him
15:1215 minutes, 12 secondswith their money while men of education will turn out to have advantage of greater intelligence and he watches like a hawk everyone
15:2115 minutes, 21 secondswho may have any other advantage over him once he's persuaded you to turn away from those people
15:2815 minutes, 28 secondshe'll have you completely isolated from friends and if you show more sense than he does in looking after your own interests
15:3415 minutes, 34 secondshe'll come to quarrel with you but if a man does not love you
15:4215 minutes, 42 secondsif it is only because of his excellence that he got what he asked for then he won't be jealous of the people
15:5015 minutes, 50 secondswho spend time with you quite the contrary he will hate anyone who doesn't want to be with you
15:5815 minutes, 58 secondshe will think they look down on him while those who spend time with you do him good so you should expect
16:0716 minutes, 7 secondsfriendship rather than end mitito as a result from this affair another point lovers generally start to
16:1616 minutes, 16 secondsdesire your body before they know your character or have any experience with your other traits with
16:2416 minutes, 24 secondsthe result that even they can't tell whether they'll still want to be friends with you after their
16:3016 minutes, 30 secondsdesire has passed non-lovers on the other hand are friends with you even before they achieve their goal and if you've
16:3816 minutes, 38 secondsno reason and you've no reason to expect the benefits received will ever detract from their friendship with
16:4616 minutes, 46 secondsyou no those things will stand as reminders of more to come
16:5516 minutes, 55 secondsanother point you can expect to become a better person if you are won over by me rather than a lover a lover will praise
17:0417 minutes, 4 secondswhat you say in what you do far beyond what is best partly because he's afraid of being disliked and partly
17:1217 minutes, 12 secondsbecause desire has impaired his judgment here is how love draws conclusions
17:2217 minutes, 22 secondswhen a lover suffers a reverse that would cause no pain to anyone else love makes him think he's accursed
17:3017 minutes, 30 secondswhen he has a stroke of luck that's not worth a moment's pleasure love compels him to sing its praises
17:3817 minutes, 38 secondsthe result is you should feel sorry for lovers not admire them if my argument wins you over i will
17:4717 minutes, 47 secondsfirst of all give you my time with no thought of immediate pleasure i will plan instead for the benefits
17:5417 minutes, 54 secondsthat are to come since i am master of myself and have not been overwhelmed by love small problems will
18:0318 minutes, 3 secondsmake me very hot will not make me very hostile and big ones will make me only gradually and only a little angry i will forgive you
18:1318 minutes, 13 secondsfor unintentional errors and do my best to keep you from going wrong intentionally all this you see
18:2118 minutes, 21 secondsis the proof of a friendship that will last a lifetime have you been thinking there could be no
18:2818 minutes, 28 secondsstrong friendship in the absence of erotic love then you ought to remember that we would not care so much about our
18:3718 minutes, 37 secondschildren if that were so or about our fathers and mothers and we wouldn't have any trustworthy friends since those relationships do not come
18:4518 minutes, 45 secondsfrom such a desire but from doing quite different things besides if it were true that we ought to give the biggest
18:5318 minutes, 53 secondsfavor to those who need it most then we should be helping out the very poorest people
19:0019 minutesnot the best ones because people we've saved from the worst troubles will give us the most thanks for instance the right people to invite
19:0919 minutes, 9 secondsto a dinner party would be beggars and people who need to sate their hunger because they're the ones who'll
19:1819 minutes, 18 secondsbe fond of us and follow us and knock on our doors and take the most pleasure with the deepest gratitude and pray for our success no
19:2719 minutes, 27 secondsit's proper i suppose to grant your favors to those who are best able to return them
19:3519 minutes, 35 secondsnot to those in direst need that is not to those who merely desire the thing but to those who really deserve it
19:4419 minutes, 44 secondsnot to people who will take pleasure in the bloom of your youth but to those who will share their goods with you when you are
19:5219 minutes, 52 secondsolder not to people who achieve their goal and then boast about it in public but to those
19:5819 minutes, 58 secondswho will keep a modest silence about it with everyone not to people whose devotion is short-lived
20:0620 minutes, 6 secondsbut to those who will be steady friends their whole lives not to the people who look for an excuse to quarrel
20:1420 minutes, 14 secondsas soon as their desire has passed but to those that will prove their worth when the bloom of your youth
20:2120 minutes, 21 secondshas faded now remember what i said and keep this in mind friends often criticize a lover
20:3120 minutes, 31 secondsfor bad behavior but no one close to a non-lover ever thinks that desire has led him into bad
20:3820 minutes, 38 secondsjudgment for his interests and now i suppose you'll ask me whether i'm urging you to give
20:4420 minutes, 44 secondsflavor favors to everyone who is not in love with you no as i see it a lover would not ask you
20:5320 minutes, 53 secondsto give in to all of your lovers either you would not in that case earn as much gratitude from each recipient and you would not be able
21:0221 minutes, 2 secondsto keep one affair secret from the others in the same way but this sort of thing is not supposed to cause any harm
21:0921 minutes, 9 secondsand really should work to the benefit of both sides well i think this speech is long enough
21:1621 minutes, 16 secondsand if you're still longing for more if you think i've passed over anything just ask
21:2521 minutes, 25 secondshow does this speech strike you socrates don't you think it's simply superb
21:2921 minutes, 29 secondsespecially in its choice of words