This class session focused on an in-depth discussion of the first five chapters of the Gospel of John. Brad opened the class, mentioning their seasonal allergies, and then guided the students into analyzing the text. The discussion began with the Prologue (John 1:1-18), exploring themes of knowing versus not knowing, direct perception (linking to *pramāṇa*), the nature of the Word (*logos*), light and darkness, and the role of John the Baptist as a witness. Students drew parallels between the creation narrative in Genesis 1/Proverbs 8 and John's opening verses. The identity and titles of Jesus were a major focus, including "Lamb of God," "Son of God," "Son of Man," and "Messiah," with discussions on their significance and potential interpretations (e.g., sacrifice, humility, divinity, humanity). The concept of Jesus's miracles as "signs" (*sēmeia*) pointing to deeper truths was highlighted, particularly the water-to-wine miracle and the healing in chapter 5 (the "sign that failed"). The interaction with Nicodemus brought up the theme of being "born again" or "born from above" through water and Spirit. The encounter with the Samaritan woman illustrated Jesus crossing social boundaries and offering "living water." The class also touched upon the relationship between Father, Son, and Spirit, the nature of the *logos* in Greek thought, the concept of *kenosis*, the body as a temple, and the notable absence of Jesus's baptism scene in John's account. Throughout the discussion, Brad encouraged students to focus on the text itself and consider its unique theological perspective.
Brad: Howdy y'all. So, I get seasonal allergies about every third or fourth year. And man, it just hit me like yesterday, just like one minute I was fine and the next minute, like major allergies and it just hasn't gone away. So, I don't think I'm contagious or anything, but yeah, anyway. So, let's dive into John's Gospel. I'm gonna do as little talking as possible today. So, would really like to hear from everybody in the room.
Brad: Why don't we get started with chapter one? So we're trying to cover chapters one through five today. Anybody have anything on, well the first verse, I feel like there's a lot in the first verse, or at least the first, the prologue, so one through 14. Yeah, Ruby, get us started.
Student 1: Well, first? Oh, like in the first verse or just the first chapter as a whole?
Brad: You're good.
Student 1: Okay. In the first chapter as a whole, I noticed a consistent theme of like acknowledging what we did not know and what the world does not know. Mm. So in the 10th verse and in the 33rd, it's like the world did not know him. And in 33 it says, I myself did not know him. And in the 18th it says, no one has ever seen him. So there's a lot of collective stuff that's said to be learned.
Brad: Right.
Student 1: Collective yeah. Yeah. So that was cool and that connects to how I don't know there was a lot. Yeah.
Brad: What?
Student 1: I was going to connect it to how there's a pro- the *pramāṇa* and how there's a valid source of knowledge and the direct perception is that we don't have that yet, but there's like more that needs added on than thinking that comes after through the interpretation.
Brad: Yeah.
Student 1: Yeah.
Brad: Yeah, really good. Yeah, cool. So, I mean, definitely major themes on knowing and not knowing and that's directly tied to direct perception, seeing, hearing, you know, direct perception. So direct perception is a big deal in John's gospel, as you're pointing out.
Brad: Yeah, George.
Student 2: I think in connection to that is like the disciple John is kind of how we on earth are able to know about God and like those kinds of concepts. And it says in verse 8, like, like John himself is not the light, but he came to testify to the light. So like, he's explaining it to everyone and testifying to I guess God's power and and like his Holy Spirit. And it said in verse nine, the true light, which enlightens everyone was coming into the world. So, he's just kind of bringing that idea to everyone through sort of a messenger, which I think helps us gain knowledge about God.
Brad: Yeah, good. And just to just to clarify, John in that, in that passage is meaning John the Baptist. Yeah. So not the author of the gospel, but yeah. So that he's the, yeah, not the light, but the one who professes the light. Yep, good.
Brad: Yeah, Jaden.
Student 3: And on that note of like verses nine and knowing, like when Jesus, like 39, where they're saying like, what are you looking for? And it's the same right there, it's like looking for Jesus, like they're seeking that knowledge, they're seeking the knowing versus not knowing.
Brad: Yep. So to know, you have to seek first. Yep. Yep.
Student 4: And I also thought it was interesting how more so in the first chapter, they were kind of like alluding to the fact that Jesus is the light that John is testifying to and it's kind of like the light that shines in the darkness and like illuminating the path to salvation that God has planned. And I also, this is like probably a stretch, but I thought like God kind of used Jesus as like, not like a pawn in his game, but like he did send him down to like, I don't know, like spread his word. And I thought that was kind of could be connected to like how God, how *līlā* is like a play, like how *līlā* is like the act of God playing. So I guess I that's like kind of a stretch, but I thought that was interesting.
Brad: Great, great. Thanks Ella.
Student 5: Yeah, I found it really interesting, like the connection of Brahman and God, especially how Brahman's very similarly described, like without Brahman, there is, I mean, nothing can not be nothing, but like there's nothing. The same way with God, like you need God for everything else to follow. So I found it this first couple lines right here, it's like very similar to what we've been learning in class and same words were kind of used as like referring to Brahman.
Brad: Okay. Alright, the first? I mean verse one?
Student 5: Yeah, verse one, just like without God, there is nothing, you know, it's just kind of like everything followed from God. You know?
Brad: Okay. All right. Others? Yeah.
Student 6: I appreciated in the first verse when it was talking about John, that it clarified that he was sent by God, but he was not himself God. Kind of talking, I I was connecting that to Krishna and then Krishna being actually God, like himself and and not human, whereas John is actually human. And then also contrasting that to Jesus who was a part of God. I was kind of trying to relate all those in my mind with the different forms of God or God's voice or whatever. I just thought that was interesting that they go immediately clarify that off the bat so that you know what what's happening. I appreciated that. It's a little bit more clear than it is in other texts.
Brad: Okay, all right.
Brad: Yeah, Ella, did you?
Student 7: Yeah, I think there's also like throughout the first chapter like a lot about purpose and sort of like morality and like how people define themselves in like relation to God, especially like through like like 19 when he comes and people are looking for him to be the Messiah and it's like how they define themselves in like opposition to him and how like John defines himself.
Brad: Okay, right. Good. Yep.
Student 8: I was wondering why like Word was capitalized? And I guess that that it kind of, I kind of understood it as like the significance of like the tie to like God and like what was being shared, like what the message actually was. Like do you think that's why it was capitalized? I guess like anyone can answer though.
Brad: So I would point out that in Greek, there's they don't capitalize words like that. So in in, in the original text, in the oldest copies of this, everything would either be written in lowercase letters or uppercase letters. There's no sort of distinction between like the beginning of the sentence isn't capitalized or that sort of stuff. So that's something that would come through in the translation, but isn't there in the original text. But every in every translation is an interpretation. So definitely significant that it's that the translator capitalizes the word. Yep.
Student 9: I also at first compared Jesus to uh Krishna becoming like how he became God, but I see differences. I think we could better compare it to what we learned in class about like the overlaps. So like the body and the soul, how like they like touch at some points. Uh, because throughout the gospel, we see how like, for example, in one part it says he was traveling with with his brothers. So that shows like his human side. But we can also see at some points where it sparks his divine side, which says to us that he's also part God, but he's he's like both at the same time. Instead of like what we learned in the other stories where Krishna was literally God. Only divine coming in the form of a kid. (sneezes) Excuse me.
Brad: Thank you. Um, where, where, where were you saying he was traveling with his brothers? What verse is that?
Student 9: Uh, I believe it was near when he was traveling to Cana with his mom, his brothers, and his disciples, it says that.
Brad: Okay.
Student 9: But I don't remember which page.
Brad: Okay. Yeah, Eric.
Student 10: Going off that, Krishna's like described as God, like God comes down to play with like *līlā*. But uh, in in John, it kind of talks about Jesus as being the, it says like the lamb, the lamb of God. So kind of God's son. He's not actually God, but he's directly tied to God himself. So I think that's a little different than uh Krishna and how he comes down as God.
Brad: Yeah, okay. I just we want to try and postpone the comparison a little bit, right? We're still just trying to get into John's gospel and what's John trying to say. Remember to keep the focus on the text.
Brad: So I think you were trying to point us Eric to verse 29 of chapter one. Okay, yeah. Let's look at that passage. The next day, Jesus coming toward him. Who's him here? Him is the uh John the Baptist. Um, here is the Lamb of God. So, John is proclaiming him to be the Lamb of God. Um, right? So direct parallel to the Passover there. Um, yeah, Molly.
Student 11: What about like comparing like Jesus to the lamb as like a symbol or like foreshadowing of how Jesus is going to be sacrificed? Mhm. Like lamb to the slaughter sacrifice.
Brad: Yeah. Yeah. And specifically referring to the Passover lamb, which is sacrificed. Yep. Um.
Student 12: That's about what I was going to say.
Brad: No, what were you going to say about it?
Student 12: Oh, I was just going to say, I I was going to literally talk about how I liked how that foreshadowing, like the Lamb of God is like how a lamb throughout the entire Bible is like symbolized as like almost like a weak, helpless creature that's just used for sacrifice. Yeah. And like you you eat the meat and you like, but like, you know, they also paint the door for the blood. It's just like, it's shows humility, it shows all that. That's like kind of what Jesus is supposed to stand for too. So instead of proclaiming, oh, son of God, like, oh, super powerful, he comes as this humble servant. You can hear that with like the Lamb of God being his title. Um, instead of like the son of God or like, you know, that.
Brad: Okay. Yep, Lauren.
Student 13: I kind of want to look at like the text more broadly and this was touched on like the reflection podcast that we listened to, but I think that the way that this specific like Gospel of John was written, makes it, I don't want to say more easy, but it's more like autobiographical, biographical. And so it's different than other theological texts where it's like can sometimes be more up to interpretation and more like symbolic. But this one is like very much telling you the story of Jesus's life. And I think that that points to trying to make Jesus separate than God in this instance and pointing to him as like someone on earth rather than just focusing on his relation to God in this instance.
Brad: Okay.
Brad: Justin.
Student 14: I find that uh passage 29 interesting because it's also just directly referencing um passage 20 uh 7 where John says that he's not worthy to untie the thong of his sandal referring to Jesus. Um and I just kind of kind of find like the constant reference to hierarchy, like the hierarchy of like who's worthy of baptizing? Who's are you are you a um like part of the clergy? Are you a uh the voice of God? Who are you? Who are you to baptize? I find these constant questions because it defines in the text as like attacks to be interesting because even though John kind of deflects most of these attacks from outsiders, he also then prescribes to this hierarchy saying that he is like not worthy of Jesus. I I find that kind of interesting.
Brad: Okay.
Student 15: I like what Laura was saying. Um too and Paul Justin's point, like Jesus is definitely like grounded in this kind of human state, especially when like right on line 29 as well as like if you go to Philip and Nathaniel, there's so many ways he's like referred to. He's Jesus of Nazareth, he's the Lamb of God. Um, he's an Israelite, he's Rabbi, like he's mentioned so many different names. Um kind of Justin's point. Like people are trying to figure out who this person is. Like it's just not some ethereal divine thing. It's he's a human, but he's labeled so many different things. And I just found that pretty significant.
Brad: Okay. Yeah, I mean definitely important to pay attention to the titles. So, so here he's referred to as the Lamb of God, as you pointed out, and the Messiah. Good. Yeah.
Brad: Um, um, Drew and then George.
Student 16: Uh one thing I was curious about if anyone had like answers to or if anyone knows anything about is like what John is if John the Baptist like knew a lot about Jesus before because he seems to like have a lot of respect for him and like kind of when people ask him, oh, like are you the true light? He's like, no, Jesus is. And then he said that just made me wonder like how does John like, like what does John know about Jesus? Like how is he encouraged to like kind of like step off, you know?
Brad: Mhm. Mhm.
Student 17: Well, I have no answers to that, but I just thought point. Um, but I don't know, we were talking about like Lamb of God and how that's seen as a sacrifice. I just found it interesting in verse um verse 36 and it says, look, here is the Lamb of God, like ex like they're exclaiming that and like they're proud of the fact that he is the Lamb of God. And but like, I'm trying to think like, are they proud of the fact that there is a sacrifice? Like is that something they're proud of? Like, I I guess it's just like sort of a cultural difference. I was wondering like what anyone really thought of that.
Brad: Yeah, Jordan.
Student 18: Well, I kind of thought of like the Lamb of God as like the savior because when like the doors were marked, that's the houses that were saved. So, I mean, I think it's like foreshadowing the um sacrifice, but I was more thinking of it as like Jesus the savior because then it goes on to talk about in later at like the it's the very end of um chapter one, how he's like the one who opens the gates of heaven. So I was thinking about it as more of like a savior sort of aspect than a sacrifice aspect.
Brad: Well, could be both, right? I mean, could be saving through sacrifice. Yeah. Yep. Um, yeah, Vanya.
Student 19: Um, I think uh what I was thinking about in general is that um how everything um how everything came through Jesus, like he was there before everything was created. And um that makes his role like even bigger than just like an like just like an historical figure. But still he was rejected and also like the dark and light thing, like how um Jesus was the light in the dark, but still he was rejected. And since we're talking about the lamb of God thing, um I liked how um John called him the lamb um because that actually shows a sense of trust and he was even he was even following him since the start and then calling him the lamb of God and following him everywhere. That showed like a sense of trust.
Brad: Okay, yeah, good. Um, um, yeah, I think I I would definitely want to dive a little bit more deeply into the um to those notions of word and light that you're pointing to in the beginning. I think, um, yeah, these first few verses would be good to pay um attention to. And also just general comment, let's be careful to distinguish between Jesus and all these other things that are going on, right? The Christ or the word or the lamb and those kind of things, right? Yeah. Yeah, Hor.
Student 20: Uh to refer to the previously mentioned points where lambs throughout the Bible are sacrificed, especially we can see it uh through the stories of David or even when Abraham was about to sacrifice his son, a lamb appears and is sacrificed instead. And then uh to the other comment about how John knew, well, I think later in the text, it says that his teacher told him, uh, whenever you see a dove, uh, go, was it on top of someone? Like, it was something with dove and a person and the dove remaining uh on top of the person, he would know that that who is coming is he.
Brad: Okay, can you point to that verse? What verse are you talking about?
Student 20: Uh, I I highlighted somewhere, but it has to be here. I mean, I could look for it and then raise my hand and read it.
Brad: 32? 32? In chapter two? Chapter one. Um, so John testified, uh this chapter 1 verse 32. John testified, I saw the spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it remained on him. I myself did not know him, but the one who sent me to baptize with water said to me, "He on whom you see the spirit descend and remain is the one who baptizes with the Holy Spirit." That's the passage you mean?
Student 20: Yeah, so I guess he was sort of a mystic or his teacher was a mystic or the one who told him was a mystic.
Brad: Yeah. So we've got in part an answer to George's question. So it seems like he says, I didn't know anything. I don't know. I don't know the bro, right? Um, so, uh, major contrast there versus like, um, Luke's gospel, because in Luke's gospel, um, Jesus and John are second cousins and their, um, their parents, their, um, Elizabeth and Mary know each other. Um, they're pregnant at the same time and stuff. Um, whereas here, John doesn't know him until, I mean, he says I don't know him. Um, and the other one is, uh, that the the spirit, um, the spirit here, which we've seen a few times already in the in the text. Um, but the spirit here has a physical form, right? Something that's can be seen. This very um visible, um, like a dove. I saw, I saw the spirit descending from heaven like a dove. So connecting with that direct perception that um Ruby was bringing in earlier. Um, good. Others?
Brad: Yeah, Ella.
Student 21: This is more of a question going off of that because remember in the deep dive it was saying like the whole point of like the John gospel is as a whole is like kind of just to show like a mission to show everyone who Jesus is. So did so is that sort of the correlation between him not necessarily knowing anything beforehand because like we're learning through this?
Brad: Um, so, I mean that the text is certainly pedagogical, meaning it's it's, you know, supposed to teach us who Jesus is. Um, but there's also, I think maybe you might have noticed uh, you know, a few places in the in these early chapters where it almost seems like uh it's speaking to the reader as if you already know. Like this was before this happened. Like you already know what's going to happen. So it's almost like um it's assuming that you kind of already know some of the story, but it's also a lot of teaching about um who he is. So both of those things are going on. Yeah. Good. Yeah.
Student 22: Going off like what you were saying about like we already know. I think that it's interesting in like line 24 like how John like doesn't really know like what's coming yet. Like when they just saying like, why are you baptizing if you're not the Messiah or anything? And he honestly like he does like he knows that he's waiting for something, but I think it's interesting that literally the next verse he was like, oh, there it is. Like the second that he saw like Jesus or like the spirit. I'm not really sure what it was at that point but like coming towards him and more of like himself like being like this is why I was sent here. Like this is why I'm baptizing with like the holy water.
Brad: Right. Yep. Good.
Brad: Definitely like to linger on the baptism a little bit more. Yeah, Molly, did you?
Student 23: Oh, um it's not about the baptism.
Brad: That's okay. What was it?
Student 23: Um I was just going to say I thought I I think it's interesting that there's so many different like ways to describe Jesus in this. Like, like it says like son of man, like king of Israel, like son of God. Um and I wonder if like they can be used like interchangeably or if it's just like um or if like each of them have like separate like specific like ways to use it. So I thought that was interesting.
Brad: Yeah, I mean, I think in general, very uh very important to pay attention to the titles that are used um for him. And um discern as best as you are able from the text itself, what John might mean from them. Um, the terms Son of Man and Son of God uh are not synonymous. They're both used to describe Jesus. Um, and so, yeah, what what do we think they they mean by those and and that sort of thing. Yeah, Jaden.
Student 24: Um I was going back to that point like also that point. Um I thought it was interesting how I think Gil brought this up also of like all like all these different names of Jesus. And I kind of thought it was like these different reflections maybe of him or like portrayals. And I thought it was interesting because they kind of felt like different reflections. It maybe tied to like in the very beginning how it's talking about like the light shining and like I guess I kind of thought about like without that light you wouldn't be able to have these and see these reflections. Mhm. Um so that's just my thought.
Brad: Good. Yeah, Matt.
Student 25: Like kind of want to go back to the I think it was line 27 where it mentioned like the um John isn't worthy of taking off uh the straps of his Jesus's sandals. I feel like it was kind of like a foreshadow to the um the washing of the feet before he was crucified. Like I feel like it also kind of connects like the miracles performed to prove his um divinity and like he was the son of God and it kind of showed how um like his humility and like his like the way of God sent him to see the world which demonstrating acts of like kindness and um like just things like that and kind of showed just like the way of living and that was like the ultimate goal of like his purpose on earth was just showing that new like movement of living, I guess.
Brad: Mhm. Good. Thank you.
Brad: Yeah, Aja.
Student 26: I have a question and I don't know if this is able to be answered. Um but I remember last semester we were talking about the Holy Trinity with God, the Son, the Holy Spirit. And I see the spirit being mentioned with Jesus a lot, how the spirit descends onto Jesus. Yeah. Um and I know they're like very closely like related and like a lot of people get them confused being the same thing. Um but like I guess like in the sense I like Jesus is the son or supposed to be the son of God and like like obviously the human version of God and like every other book. Um but how is that like how how is the spirit differentiated like when it's coming down onto Jesus? Like how how are we supposed to differentiate the two here in the sense of the baptism?
Brad: Yeah, I mean, um, I think, I mean, great questions. Yeah, I don't I don't necessarily want to answer them. I don't I don't think I have answers to them, but um, but I think it's important to ask the questions and to discuss those. Um, and so, yeah, I mean, we have the the doctrine of the Trinity, which is definitely developed after the Bible was written, right? Um, but not not in a vacuum. And so, you know, when um when those doctrines of the Trinity are written, John certainly a key uh key source for all of that. I mean, very, very clearly have Father and Son and distinct distinct from one another and spirit. So you do have Father, Son and Spirit, all three playing very important roles in this text, um, in a way that um is certainly different from the other gospels. I know we're not reading the other gospels, but um, but um, but yeah, as far as the relationship between them, um, I mean God self and society, I taught what the church taught, but those are later developments, right? So now focusing on this text, it's hard to read it without centuries of interpretation. Um, I mean it's impossible to read it without centuries of interpretation. Um, so I'm not going to pretend like we can do that. But at the same time, um, let's uh, let's not assume that those um that the Trinitarian doctrines are exactly what's in the text, you know what I'm saying? Um, so all of that's just to say those are great questions. Keep asking them. Um, yeah.
Brad: Yeah, Eliana.
Student 27: Something that kind of sparked my curiosity was like the way everyone sort of knows their place in terms of like who Jesus is and their place in respect to him. And I I like never had sort of thought about it before and I don't know if this is just because we're reading one passage, but kind of seeing how like John, again, like talking about the washing of the feet and whatnot and he won't do it and like he's like, I'm waiting for Jesus and like Jesus comes and he's like, that's him. Like how he sort of like found that place or like got to that place of having that respect because I know like obviously like later on it talks about how like Jesus says like one of you will like betray me and like it's obviously Judas, but like no one knows and like how only like one person would do that to him. I mean, obviously there are so many people that like didn't believe him and whatnot, but like how the disciples were so in line with like everything he wanted and were able to respect him and not like overstep him or like kind of like take credit for what Jesus was doing and their ability to like step back and like give him like the spotlight. That's something I'd never really thought about before until reading this and like how they assumed those positions surrounding Jesus. So I just thought that was interesting.
Brad: Yeah, good. Good. Yeah.
Student 28: Just adding to that idea of status, well, not status, but like having him as superior. I also like the point that um the podcast you and I were talking about that we heard was like when Jesus believing Jews were being marginalized and like even called us heretics. And then that during that when they faced opposition, it's actually when their faith grew and they started seeing Jesus more than just like a superior thing. They were like, he's like divine revelation and everything we need for like eternal grace, you know? So I think like a lot of times throughout history, whenever people have faced opposition, they've seen that as a time for like growing faith with this idea of like, he's going to give us whatever we deserve and an afterlife or whatever it is, you know?
Brad: Yeah, okay, good.
Brad: Yeah, Mary.
Student 29: Yeah, um I was going back to like Eliana's point a little bit like how Jesus had like so much status and respect as well. Like I think um like especially in the second um chapter of John, like when they use the example of like how uh Jesus turned the water into wine and like um had that like kind of like made that miracle and like kind of proved that as like he missed a miracle worker. And I think that like that's kind of why he had so like such like strong disciples who like really believed in him and like followed him because he was doing these things that like were seen as divine and seen as like no one else was able to do that.
Student 29: And I also noticed like in that same chapter, um on lines 19, um where he says like destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up, which is like another example of like some sort of miracle and the people like the Jews they thought he was talking about like an actual temple, but like he was really referring to his own body. And like when um like they use the example of like when he was raised from the dead. Um and I thought it was really interesting and like how he kind of is saying that his body is the temple, which I thought was related to kind of what we were talking about as our bodies being like the vessel for the divine. And like even though Jesus himself is divine, like he's in a human body and a human form and like people can almost relate to that in a way and like I know last semester we talked a lot about like *kenosis*. So I thought that was really similar to that of like he is like divine but like he's in a human form, he's letting the divine like reside inside of him.
Brad: Mhm. Yeah, good.
Brad: Yeah, Andrea.
Student 30: Um I also really like that this uh chapter kind of follows where Jesus was kind of criticizing the Pharisees for the fact that they would follow all of the Jewish cultures but then don't believe in when he's presenting all of these signs. And then going into this chapter where he talks to the Samaritan woman, which is something very unlike a third Jewish person to do. So that's kind of similar to that point from earlier where it's like it's just symbolizing that Jesus came to save all people and not just the Jewish people.
Brad: Mhm. Yeah, good. Yeah.
Student 31: Um so back to back to Mary's point like I feel like I guess like like the idea of like your body being temple like made me think of like um I guess just taking like um communion in in church and basically how like we like actually eat like the physical body of Christ in church. And I feel like that like like also like as I was reading like I found like when he was like fully man and fully God, like I guess fully man, I like I found myself kind of thinking that was like almost like less superior in a way, but but like if like in reality like we are at church to basically like eat like this like manliness in a way. And I feel like if you think of like the man in a more like connotation basically like basically like like isn't God, but it's man, like you kind of it kind of I know like for me like I I like I I had to like almost like check myself and like kind of think like, no, like that's also like equally as profound as being God. And I feel like even now like in church like when you think of like his body as like a temple, like his body as like holy in itself, like it kind of creates like a new idea for me at least about being like human.
Brad: Mhm. Okay, yeah, good. Yeah.
Student 32: I'm going off of past point they made about the miracles and foreshadowing those. I really liked how uh it pointed out the idea that he doesn't call these miracles, but he calls them signs. And this calls on the overall idea of like he wants us to read this not as a story, but like it's not because I feel like people get really used to reading the Bible and just remembering the stories without really like diving into what they represent. So I like the idea of like being they're like signs or like pieces of evidence for like Jesus like divinity and mission rather than just like just a simple like story like other people convey, you know?
Brad: Yeah, no, really important point. Really important point. Um, yeah, so in the in this gospel, Jesus performs seven signs. He performs maybe more than more than seven miracles. Um, but seven of the miracles are specifically referred to as signs and numbered as such, right? The first of his signs, the second of his signs. Seven is a really um symbolic, important uh number, the number of completion, the number of um, you know, days of creation and um seven days in a week and that sort of thing. Um, and so we'll see the number seven come up. Uh John uses a lot of symbolism and uh and that's definitely a significant one of them. And yeah, good that you're noticing those.
Brad: Yeah, Justin.
Student 33: I found the sign in chapter five very interesting when he goes to heal the um the blind and lame man. Yeah. Um and he goes in and he cures him. Um but rather than this being a successfully interpreted sign, the Jews considered this to be heresy. Um especially with Jesus's defense that well, it was the Sabbath, but it was not me, it was the Lord who was working on the Sabbath. And the Jews reject that. Um I find this to be interesting because it kind of uh I got this from the notes mostly, but it was saying that this was um a breaking of the pattern of like um questioning and then rejection and then acceptance after the uh the the healing is done. In this case, there was questioning and then there was healing, and then there was rejection after the healing, which is different from the pattern of the other signs, which I found that to be interesting.
Brad: Good. Yeah, interesting. That's in the notes?
Student 33: Yeah, they were mentioning here that how this follows, they called this one um the sign that failed. Um chapter started chapter five because unlike some of the other signs of the Samaritans where he was doubted and then accepted. In this case, he was doubted, he proved it, and then he was rejected by the Jews after the fact.
Brad: So he's rejected even after given proof, right? So here's proof. It's fine to, you know, doubt me before the proof, but then you're rejecting me even after you've seen the proof. Yeah. Yeah, interesting because it is it's a break in the pattern.
Student 33: And also I think it kind of shows a little bit of Jesus's issue, I suppose with like sedentary faith, which is that like you're going to run into issues with the way that they interpret it versus the way that Jesus is trying to preach to them. And so it's less about proof and more about like the powers that be.
Brad: Yeah. Good. So tying back to what uh where Ruby started us off that direct perception is really, really, really important. Um, but in some cases, in that case, um you have people that are seeing for themselves, seeing with their own eyes and then still not believing, right? Um, and so seeing and believing, the relationship between seeing and believing, um, major theme throughout the entire text that we'll continue to see um going forward. Good. Yeah, Lauren.
Student 34: Um I think using the term like the sign that failed, it's really interesting because it points to how the sign itself, like the action is not at all like the purpose of what Jesus is doing. It's more so the result and spreading um this faith. And so I think using the term miracle instead of sign can often point to like the action being the purpose of it and even almost being like accidental or a fluke. But the sign like using the word sign means that there's a deeper meaning and it goes further than just
Brad: That it's done, the miracles performed with a specific purpose in order to be a sign, something for people to see. Yeah, I think that's that's right. Yeah. Good. Others? Yeah, Avery.
Student 35: I think that the concept like of seeing and believing is like interesting especially like at the very beginning with like the concept of light. Mhm. Like because in the text like it said like testified to the light but also it enlightens people. Right. So like I think it's interesting that like when uh John was talking to like the others that were questioning like his baptizing and such, like they weren't like believing but like they could see but like when the spirit or Jesus like descended down, like John actually like saw it and believed that and like felt that actual purpose.
Brad: Mhm. Yeah, good. Good.
Brad: I mean, those, um, which which takes us back to, uh, the the very beginning of the text. Um, and, uh, you know, I wonder if we could just take a moment or two and see some of the parallels between, um, the prologue, this, you know, this first 14, the first 14 verses are referred to as the prologue or sometimes up through 19, 18. Um, but how these verses connect with some of the other readings that I've assigned this semester, like Genesis 1 and um, definitely Genesis 1, Proverbs 8 and some Psalm 104. Any connections you see? Yeah, Eric.
Student 36: Yeah, well just make connection to Genesis in um line three, it says all things came to be through him, and without him nothing came to be. So kind of connects to nothing existed before God and he was like the creator of everything. Um so I think that direct comparison for Genesis.
Brad: Yeah, sure, good. But and here the the him, I think refers to the word, right? So the word of God. Um, so everything comes to be through the word, um, which is described as him here because it's a masculine um word, but um, yeah, I don't know. Ellen, Addison and Ruby. George.
Student 37: I was just gonna say like all of the connection in the word between like Genesis, um Proverbs 8 and John, like I feel like in Genesis it was like creation, like there was like God speaking and then the word and like there was like surrounding around creation. Yeah. And then like obviously this starts in the beginning there was the word and then also like I feel like in Proverbs it was like more surrounding like wisdom and the word but like how those intertwined.
Brad: Right. So exactly right. So then uh Genesis 1, creation happens through speech. Um and Proverbs 8, it's like, well, before speech, there must be wisdom, right? And then from that wisdom comes the word. Um and so, yeah, we've got it's almost like a strength a stretching out of that first moment of creation where God speaks and things happen. Um now it's like the we're focusing on the word itself that is doing the doing the action, which is not unrelated to the um uh wisdom that we saw earlier. Yeah, great. Um Addison and then Ruby, yeah, lots lots of people.
Student 38: I was going to talk about uh the connection with like just in the beginning was the word, like literally almost the same in the beginning, there was just nothing. And so instead now he says the word and so with the word being created from that wisdom. And then it goes on to talk about the light and the darkness. And that's also direct day two or three in the creation. I mean exactly it was like let there be light. Um and that's a direct correlation to Genesis um with light being mentioned here. Yeah. And how light shines on the darkness and the darkness just can't take the light and light is supposed to be the word and that word is spread through Jesus, John, etc. And that's exactly what they're talking about.
Brad: Excellent. Great. Thank you. Yeah.
Student 39: I'd like to draw comparisons between the light and the good that was referenced in Genesis 1 when God was creating things and he said or and he created something and it was good. Right. So when in nine it says the true light which enlightens everyone, like the good is for everyone. But then also in verse five when it says the light shines in the darkness and the darkness did not overcome it, that reference I feel that draws more comparisons to Genesis 2 and how darkness like there is good and evil that both balance and live together because here the light does not overcome the darkness but the darkness doesn't like they are balanced and that can be coexistent and peaceful in the same way that like both light and darkness are necessary.
Brad: Yeah, great, good.
Brad: Uh George.
Student 40: Yeah, um kind of just segueing into verse six. Um, it says there was a man sent from God whose name was John. Um, and in Genesis 1: 26 and 27, we talked about of like the concept of *imago dei*, like image of and how this like physical representation of not like God or not God himself, but um like through John, it gives us something to sort of rationalize the idea or the concepts um and allows us to like better grasp it when we have like something physical that we can kind of uh like uh I guess relate to.
Brad: Okay, yeah, good. Yep, true.
Student 41: Yeah, I think one connection between this and Adam and Eve is that well in verse 10 it says, he was in the world and the well start with nine, the true light which gives light to everyone that's coming to the world. He was in the world and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. So there's kind of like tension that's being created between like like the creator and like the subjects kind of similar with Adam and Eve.
Brad: Yeah, okay. where So maybe even like a second Adam, right? Which uh which could be um tying back to the son of man, right? So man is another um in Hebrew is Adam, right? So Adam just means man. So son of man could mean son of Adam or a second Adam. Um so a second, you know, second shot at creation kind of thing. Yeah, Hola.
Student 42: I was also going to mention Adam and Eve, but actually in the next sentence when it says disciples walk in light, but many prefer darkness. So the idea that he has always guided us towards the good, but then people fall out in the way not knowing how to find that good. I think this is in God self and society too, but like the idea of people falling out in the way. So this well, it's mainly temptation, but I think that did a good recall of how in Genesis they knew what was right subconsciously, but then decided to do something else.
Brad: Okay, yeah. Yep. So clearly again, like some people know, some people see, but still
Student 42: But still turn their back and still do something different.
Brad: Yep, good. Yeah.
Student 43: I have a question on like line uh verse one where it's like saying that there was the word, the word was with God and the word was God. Yeah. I guess I'm I don't know if I understand like what that means.
Brad: Right. Yeah, um and there's uh I would quibble a little bit with the translation. Um I had a theologian um who's here at Boston College down the hall a couple years ago, um and he just like completely rocked my world. Um when he pointed out that uh the the Greek, which I I forgot my glasses today, so I have to hold it very far. Fortunately, my arms are still long enough. *En archē hēn ho logos kai ho logos hēn pros ton theon kai theos hēn ho logos*. Um so got that? Um Yeah. That throws it through. In *archē*, uh so in the beginning, *hēn ho logos* was *ho ho* is uh the, right? So the word. So in the beginning was the word and the word um *hēn pros ton theon*. So *pros* means like towards or with, so nearby, but really means like towards. *Pros* like like pro, right? Like pro like towards, forward. So towards so um the *logos* was towards God, the God, *ton theon*. *Kai theos*. So here it's not so uh in in English and the way that this translation renders it, um the word was with God, capital G, and the word was God, capital G. But the word God in the Greek is different actually. It's um *theon* and *theos*. And the *theos* lacks any definite article. Um so it's not um So maybe a better way would instead of in the beginning was the word and the word was with God. I think that's all fine. Um but then the last phrase is and *theos hēn ho logos*. So Theo like the order is reversed. So you could maybe translate it as God was the word, which is different than saying the word was God, right? Um but here Theos lacks the definite article. So it could be just the word was divine or divine was the word, I think. So the most literal translation would be in the beginning was the word and the word was towards or oriented towards God or with God, um um and divine was the word would be the most literal way of taking it.
Student 44: Maybe dumb question. What is the word?
Brad: So, um, so the word in in Greek is *logos*. *Logos* *logos* means word, but *logos* is a super important word in Greek. So, um, you know, almost everything that we've got all these English words like biology, all these *logies*, right? So the *logy*, l o g y, that's a form of *logos*. So the um and also logic where we get the word logic is the word *logos*. So *logos* um *logos* is uh *logos* is not it doesn't just mean word, right? It's I don't know how to explain how important it is in Greek philosophy, Greek theology, but um but here it's it's taken up even another notch and saying that the word was um divine. Yeah, I don't know. I'm just kind of giving you information. I I think maybe I if I had a train of thought, I lost it. Was there a question?
Student 45: I was kind of asking like Yeah. what what does what is the word? Because like I think sort of understanding what God is is a little bit easier than what's the word? Yeah. Like the word is God and we're not thinking it's not word isn't a English definition, but you're like you're saying it's like a higher Greek definition. Yeah. Like more like logic or something like that.
Brad: Yes. Uh, yeah, that's right. Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Student 46: Um well, I thought that the word was like God's message and that Jesus was put here and like how Ella was saying earlier like sent down um like to like promote God's word and God's message. That's what I thought. That was my thought process for the word.
Brad: No, that makes sense. I like that.
Student 47: I guess another way that like I would kind of think of it is like if you're looking at it from like a *logos* perspective, like biology, like *ology* is like the study of and like bio is like earth like the study of like that's where the word comes from. Like *ology* like *logos* is like the study of or like knowledge. You guess you could say like to combine the two like knowledge of God's message is like I guess.
Brad: So I mean, *logos* word is definitely a way of communicating meaning and and knowledge. Yeah. Alexa, did you have something? No. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.
Student 48: I know, I just think just kind of a different point but just like in general, I think it's interesting how the correlation just between God's word and light. It's like when God speaks or when there's presence of God, there is light versus when God doesn't speak or God is not in presence, there's like darkness, evil. So I just thought that correlation was interesting.
Brad: Yeah, I think I think so too, right? And so and light is it um I mean light seems to be taken at first literally, but but then increasingly metaphorically there, right? And so likewise word. So then that word becomes, you know, the uh the light and meaning like the good, right? Yeah, especially in that Platonic sense, yeah.
Student 49: Um speaking of light in chapter five, um I think it's verse uh 36, 30 somewhere in the 31 to 37 lines. He in his defense um uh during trial, he mentions that he is a uh a burning and shining lamp. Yeah, 35. Um you know, basically saying that he is like a burning and shining lamp, maybe not a direct interpretation of God's light, but shines God's light upon the people around him. Um and that they get to bask in his light. Yeah, so that's kind of another interesting call back to light being good and being God and and Jesus being a lamp for that light. Yeah. Maybe not the light directly, but a vessel for that light.
Brad: Yeah, yeah. Oh yeah, or both of those things. Yeah. Yeah, Hor.
Student 50: I mean, he's not the light directly. I think we could tie what we were talking about previously with this. I would replace, it isn't much of a stretch, but this is how I explained it to someone yesterday when I was reading it. Uh, I think it's imperative to do comparisons when reading this. Um, like in the beginning was the word. I mean, the word like they knew like people were handing down stories, especially because this was like Jesus was trying to change uh traditionally religion when he came here. And so we could say that the word to be like what we know, like for example, the day today includes what was known. What was known in God is God. And and then the word became flesh. But then later in chapter three, uh Jesus says like uh is it three? That he was born from water and spirit capitalized. Mhm. So like, I mean, he's not saying that he is the light as you said, like he's like this lamp that where the light shines through, which is why he is like body and spirit as well. Man and God at the same time.
Brad: Okay, yeah. Good. Um, and I I definitely want to come back to the the word made flesh in verse 14. Yeah, Alexa.
Student 51: I like, I was reading in the notes because I was thinking about the question that was made about the word. And it says, I think this is interesting. It says, Jesus reveals and conceals as a revealer, he's the word of God who speaks God's words. And then, but he also conceals it so that only insiders hear and know his revelation. And then it makes a point of how, for example, with the Samaritan woman in the well, she thought of water as a physical water when he was making a double meaning um as it was like self-fulfillment and eternal grace, not just the water. So I think this is a good example of the word as they were saying, it was God's word, but it's also in a more broader sense, it's like you will get to know it by following his path and only by believing in him, you will get to know all this word, you know, in a sense, it's like, if you don't follow him, you'll never get to understand the definition. So it's like the path of like his life and ongoing creation and because also, sorry I'm
Brad: No, you're fine. Good.
Student 51: In the video we saw, it was talking about how apocalyptic themes when uh for him were more like focusing the present and then eternal grace and all that stuff were secondary. So I think this points towards the same thing of like focus on following God's like world now and path now and then you'll understand the word now and don't focus too much on like what comes after, you know?
Brad: Yeah, no, that's I think that's really important. Um, point that uh that temporality in John's gospel is hyper focused on the now, very much on the now. Yep.
Student 52: It's like said about question, there's a reference to the devil in um chapter uh 6 towards the very end, like 71. Okay. Um do you know where like when that's first mentioned in text? Like is that I think they they don't define it or mention it fully expect you to know who that is, but it's never mentioned before in John. So like, do you know like where that comes from like as a
Brad: Well, I'm going to punt that till we get to, we'll get to chapter six next week. Yeah, um but yeah, I'll uh I'll prepare for that question then.
Brad: Yeah, Jaylene.
Student 53: Um in 3:3, um Jesus says you need to be born again to enter the kingdom of God. And what does he mean when he says born again? Like what definition is he using? Yeah.
Brad: Um, because I don't know if he means reincarnation or what, but I just I he was talking about being born again to enter the kingdom of God, but I don't really know what born again means. Right. Good. Um, yeah, no, it's uh it's important. Can we look at that verse? You said three, what? 3:3. 3:3. Um, there was a Pharisee named Nicodemus, leader of the Jews. He came to Jesus uh by night and said to him, Rabbi, we know that you're a teacher and has come from God, for no one can do these signs that you do apart from the presence of God. Jesus answered him, very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God without being born from above. Nicodemus said, how can anyone be born after having grown old? Can one enter a second time into uh the mother's womb and be born? Jesus said, very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God without being born of water and spirit. What is born of flesh is flesh, what is born of the spirit is spirit. So, um, well, I think uh that could raise great, really important. Thank you for drawing attention to that passage. Um, and that question. Um, I mean, one of the things that we might take a moment to uh notice is that there's no birth narrative here, right? There's no uh incarnation. Um, there's no there's no birth narrative, right? So the birth narrative we only find in um Matthew's gospel and Luke's gospel. Um, so here the the Jesus's ministry begins primarily with baptism. And there at the baptism, we see the Holy Spirit descending on him and remaining on him, um that uh pointed that passage. Um, is the baptism the born again? The baptism is the born again and that's being born of the spirit. Um, and there's definitely, I mean, there's some um, you know, entering the waters is like entering the waters of the womb, right? And then there's a birth out of the water that's being born in spirit that that can happen at any at any time. And um then the last thing, and I'll jump to Lena, but um verse 12, so chapter 1 verse 12, um to all who received him, meaning the word, and believed in his name, he gave the power to become children of God. So becoming a child of God, becoming a son of God or a daughter of God is not something unique to this kid named Jesus, but is open to anybody, right? Um, and so uh so yeah, that emphasis on being born again in this sense means a spiritual birth. Um and that spiritual birth um requires receiving the spirit, receiving the word, um and maybe some kind of *kenosis* or emptying um as a prerequisite to that. But that we can punt to later. Yeah.
Student 54: You kind of covered everything I wanted to say, but I also was thinking about the being born again as like entering into heaven and having like the the afterlife and not necessarily like being born again to like repent for your sins or like considering like we talked about in like other religions having to like keep going until you get it right per se. But I thought it was interesting how in this passage they talked about how you're kind of like dying and you're being reborn whether it's through your spirit and through and like apart from your body or if like you're going into heaven or you're going into like the afterlife and using that as like your time to like repent for your sins or like find purpose in your life or reflect on what you did in your lifetime on earth and then like having a separate life there. And then again talking about how like the flesh is flesh and your spirit is spirit like having that differentiation of like your body on earth versus your body when you're reborn again either through like baptism or like dying and how like those are not like contingent on each other and they're kind of separate.
Brad: Okay, yeah. So so then raising the question of um Kingdom of God and whether Kingdom of God um or Kingdom of Heaven is something um right from one interpretation would be heaven is uh something that you enter after death, right? So then that would be a third birth. So then your birth in the body and then a second birth and then a third birth um after death into this heaven, which is one one way of interpreting um Kingdom of Heaven. Yep.
Student 55: Yeah, I really resonated with what Lena said, uh especially in the baptism because from my own personal experience, like my senior year of high school, I went to like get confirmed in the Catholic church. Uh and baptism was like a super important part because like it cleanses you of all of your sin up until that point. Um which like in the moment almost not in a weird way but like felt like a new me kind of thing, you know? It's like a washing, a cleansing, almost like a a rebirth sort of thing with that whole process.
Brad: Yep. Yep, good.
Student 56: One thing that stuck out to me is like in this annotation it says wind and spirit translates the same Greek and Hebrew words. And in line eight, it's so line eight is the wind blows where it wishes and you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. Mhm. So if that if you can substitute like spirit for wind there, like it just seems like a kind of a strange line. Like the spirit blows where it wishes as if like it's kind of it does its own thing. Like you can't really like go out and like find the spirit if it blows where it wishes, you know, if that's what that means. Yeah. And then if you keep on reading, you hear its sound, but you do not know where it comes from or where it goes. Mhm. That I don't know. It feel like that doesn't make too much sense because like Jesus is like right here like you know, sharing the spirit, like sharing the word. And yet like people and yet this is saying that you don't know where it comes from. So I don't know.
Brad: Yeah, good. So, um, one one connection we might draw there is to Genesis 1 uh verse 3, the um um the *Rūaḥ ʾĔlōhīm* that we talked about earlier, the spirit of God, the breath of God, the wind of God, that *Rūaḥ* is the wind or spirit, the word that you're saying there, as you point out, um means breath, wind or spirit, um all the same word. And that in Genesis 1 chapter or chapter 1 verse 3 was the spirit that blew over the face of the deep, right? So the waters were there and then the wind of God blows over the face of deep and that's the beginning origin of creation. And here, that same spirit, um seems to be, it seems to be the same spirit described there. Um, that it goes where it will, right? That God is or the spirit is free and not limited. And um, and unpredictable, right? Um, and then so it could be that uh he on whom um uh yeah, I'm reading chapter 1 verse uh um 33. Um he on whom, this is John speaking, he on whom you see the spirit descend and remain is the one who baptizes with the Holy Spirit. And I myself have seen and testify um that this is the son of God. So then, yeah, so the spirit seems to take over Jesus's body, right? So Jesus becomes the Christ at that point when he's anointed by the spirit. And that spirit then is the one in charge now, right? And then so, um perhaps that is how one becomes a child of God is by emptying oneself, a kind of *kenosis* and uh emptying one's ego in order to be filled with the spirit. Um maybe connections there to the wine and uh the Canaan wedding. So when it when one is filled with the spirit, then one becomes more unpredictable because one is going where God wants rather than where one desires.
Brad: Yeah, Justin.
Student 57: Um to also go into chapter three. I was a little confused about Jesus's intention in his response to the Pharisee Nicodemus because um I wasn't sure if he was ridiculing Nicodemus for his like claims of knowledge um or if he was genuinely trying to explain to Nicodemus his point of like his his his reasoning for being on on on earth like as as a vessel for God. I thought it was a little bit of both. But now that you're bringing up this point about the spirit of God, I think he was kind of hitting Nicodemus with a double entendre where maybe saying like you don't understand the way that the wind works while saying you don't understand the earth, so you can't claim full knowledge because that would be yeah you get it's not you you it's too much ego. But simultaneously you don't understand how the spirit works. Um and so he's kind of making double point, double edge point there um towards Nicodemus because Nicodemus was like the leader of the Jews. And so Nicodemus's questions were a bit pointed. And I think this is kind of like a little bit of Jesus's clap back moment towards Nicodemus, but also trying to get Nicodemus to realize like, look, your interpretation of both the spirit and the earthly realm is not is not is not entirely correct. We should review this. Um now that you guys are talking about the wind, I thought that was yeah.
Brad: Okay, yeah. Cool.
Brad: Uh, yeah, Jack.
Student 58: Um so just going back to verses like 12 and 13 of chapter one, is that like also saying that becoming a child of God is not just for the Israelites and like not just for the Jewish people, which is kind of what the Old Testament says?
Brad: Um good question. I mean it it says to all who receive him and believe in his name, he gave the power to become children of God. So that doesn't seem to be much limitation on it. Yeah. Certainly not a um an ethnic um limitation like you would find in the Hebrew scriptures. Yeah, Matt.
Student 59: This might be a dumb question. Um if I'm reading right, is it verse like 31 or 32 to 34? Is that Is John baptizing Jesus in that moment? Um I was just curious why if Jesus is the son of God, why is it that he needs to get baptized when you or be pure of his sins at that point or is he kind of just doing it as like a demonstration to the people that like you should go through the process of baptism?
Brad: Yeah. Okay, good. So so many things to um to to draw attention to there. One is um I think the the typical interpretation would be that Jesus only becomes the son of God at the baptism, right? So yeah, in in Luke's gospel, Jesus uh becomes the son of God because he's got because Mary is impregnated with his spirit, right? Um but we don't find anything like that. Instead, we find this second birth as Jaylene is pointing to. And so that rebirth um is the moment when Jesus becomes the son of God. So that's the beginning of the son of God on earth, right? It's through that spirit that embodies or takes over, right? Possesses his body. Um so it's sort of a spiritual possession, right? And it descends like a like a dove. And that um being possessed by the spirit of God is something that's not limited to this this guy, but is open to anybody, right?
Student 59: So is he just a prophet between birth and the holy the baptism, I guess?
Brad: Uh, prophet's a little bit of a loaded term. So, I think we would say that John the Baptist is definitely playing the role of a prophet of sort of proclaiming the one who is to come, clearing the way. And then Jesus is less of a prophet and more of an exemplar. More yeah, more of an exemplar.
Student 60: It says in the notes that in John the in John uh the Gospel of John that John the Baptist actually doesn't baptize Jesus.
Brad: Well, yeah, I mean, we don't need the notes for that. But yeah, so uh do you see any place where John, I mean, there's a whole lot of talk about baptism. John was baptizing people and so many baptisms going on. And then we seem to be leading up to this moment where Jesus gets baptized, but then it's just like it's not there, right? It's just kind of not there. What do you think of that? This something you know, people who read the text have always been kind of like, wait, why isn't it there? It's like you're teasing us with this baptism that's not that's described but not just not reported.
Student 60: My thought on it was kind of that John's a very humble guy, specifically in this kind of whole text and lead up to to Jesus's arrival. He's very much like, look, it's not about me, it's not about me, it's about the guy who's coming, it's about Jesus, it's about Jesus. And then Jesus gets there and I feel like if he was I feel like most of the importance is kind of centered around what Jesus does after he becomes the Messiah as opposed to the actual moment of becoming the Messiah, kind of implying that I think he's always meant to be the Messiah. So it doesn't matter that much when he becomes the Messiah, it more matters like what he does. Um that was my interpretation. So like maybe if you show the baptism, especially John doing the baptism, it puts too much importance on John. That was kind of my thoughts on it. I don't know if that's resonant or not.
Brad: Yeah. Yeah, I think yeah, I think you're on the right track. Yeah, Georgia.
Student 61: I was kind of thinking the similar thing. I mean, I was surprised to like not see it in there. But I also think because I feel like it was an opportunity maybe for like, I guess like I think it's like a very personal experience, which is maybe why they didn't include it. Like I think it's more like mental than physical. But where I was surprised was like that they didn't use it as an opportunity for um for symbolism. But I agree with Justin in how it was kind of like, it's like what you do with that like rebirth opportunity less than um like the moment itself.
Brad: Mhm. Mhm. Good. Um, any other passages we haven't gotten to? Um, maybe want to draw our attention to another section passage?
Brad: We could talk Yeah. Yeah, Molly.
Student 62: Um, chapter four with Jesus and the woman. Mhm. Um, as I was reading it, I was kind of thinking that like it seemed like it was like a really like intimate encounter. Yeah. And like the way that it was written, it just was like, it seemed like he wanted to like really show that he was like human and like that he like could connect with her like on a human level.
Brad: Yeah. Yeah, it's a very intimate encounter, right? Um there's just the two of them, nobody else is around. Um and uh yeah, maybe we could folks draw more attention to that chapter four. Yeah, Luke.
Student 63: Uh I thought it was interesting. I'm pretty sure it's Lane speaking about being thirsty and the woman's like thinking literal, but then Jesus being not literal. Yeah. Where it's like filling a thirst you'll never be thirsty again. Yeah. I thought that was interesting how it's like someone getting Catholicism who has spoke about like having a God-shaped hole Yeah. in your heart. Yeah. This I feel like this kind of goes into that idea of like humans having a thirst for something but not being able to ever fill that. Yes. And like this is you say like you could fill that this how you could live.
Brad: Yeah, really, really good. Really great. Um, yeah, Andrea.
Student 64: Um I also really like that this uh chapter kind of follows where Jesus was kind of criticizing the Pharisees for the fact that they would follow all of the Jewish cultures but then don't believe in when he's presenting all of these signs. And then going into this chapter where he talks to the Samaritan woman, which is something very unlike a third Jewish person to do. So that's kind of similar to that point from earlier where it's like it's just symbolizing that Jesus came to save all people and not just the Jewish people.
Brad: Mhm. Yeah, good.